Thunder 380 and +P ammo.?.?

Discussion in 'General Bersa Discussion' started by squeak_D, Oct 2, 2012.

  1. squeak_D

    squeak_D Member

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    Hey folks, new to the forum. How well does the Thunder 380 handle +P ammo?
     
  2. SHOOTER13

    SHOOTER13 RETIRED MODERATOR Lifetime Supporter

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    Welcome to the Bersa Forum squeak_D !!

    From the FAQ: http://www.bersa.com/bersa-faq

    What kind of ammunition can I use in my BERSA pistol?

    +P rated ammunition is acceptable for use in BERSA firearms. For your knowledge, it is a possibility that the constant use of this ammunition may increase the normal wear of the gun. Additionally, hollow and or flat-nose bullets can be used if they are in standard commercial cartridges. However, sometimes the hollow point bullets will not feed, in which the feed ramp will need to be polished. This is not covered under warranty.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2012

  3. squeak_D

    squeak_D Member

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    Thanks.., had no idea there was a dedicated Bersa forum until today:) I've got the Thunder 380 DuoTone.., and "hopefully" will be getting the BP9cc soon.
     
  4. BT380

    BT380 Well-Known Member

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    As far as I've seen, there is really no such thing a +P ammo for the 380.
     
  5. squeak_D

    squeak_D Member

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    I'm pretty sure MagTech and Buffalo Bore make them.
     
  6. SHOOTER13

    SHOOTER13 RETIRED MODERATOR Lifetime Supporter

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    Last edited: Oct 2, 2012
  7. squeak_D

    squeak_D Member

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    Hey Shooter.., what part of PA are you from? I grew up in Meadville (where Allegheny College and Channel-lock tools is located).

    Thanks for posting that info. Would love to know how the Bersa 380's handle this stuff from people using it.
     
  8. BT380

    BT380 Well-Known Member

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    Never seen any Buffalo Bore ammo in my area and the MagTech only is range 95 gr ammo around here. The hottest I can get is reloads a friend of mine does for his PPK
     
  9. squeak_D

    squeak_D Member

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    Hmmmm, maybe the question I really should be asking is:

    Are the Bersa Thunder .380's even rated for +P ammo.?.?
     
  10. BT380

    BT380 Well-Known Member

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    That might be the better question. ;) I don't want to shoot to hot a load as I don't want to wear out parts.
     
  11. SHOOTER13

    SHOOTER13 RETIRED MODERATOR Lifetime Supporter

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    You're in Crawford County...about 40 miles from Erie...right ?


    I'm in SE Pennsylvania...Montgomery County...Abington Twp.
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2012
  12. bhale187

    bhale187 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    According to SAAMI, there is not, just as there is no +p 40cal. However, there are several companies that make both 380 and 40 in what they call +p. There is also no such thing as +p+ for any caliber according to SAAMI, but again several companies make rounds they call +p+
     
  13. SHOOTER13

    SHOOTER13 RETIRED MODERATOR Lifetime Supporter

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    +P FACTS


    The term "+p" refers to ammunition which is loaded by the manufacturer to a pressure level above the normal SAAMI specification. But "+p" is still a recognized SAAMI specification (e.g., 9mm+p, .45ACP+p).

    The term +p+, used only in reference to 9mm ammunition usually, refers to a round loaded beyond any SAAMI specifications. Most NATO-spec ammunition tends to be +p+. There is no SAAMI specification for "+p+" ammunition.

    By manufacturing ammunition to a higher pressure level, companies can achieve greater velocity with any given bullet. This means more momentum and muzzle energy, but usually an increase in recoil and muzzle flip as well (particularly in .45ACP +p).

    There is no such thing as .40S&W +p! Period. No exceptions. There is not a SAAMI specification for .40S&W loads beyond the standard pressure. Any company which sells ammunition loaded above the standard SAAMI specification is selling dangerous ammunition. There are no firearms rated to use such ammunition. If you really feel you need a .40S&W +p, you can go out and buy a proper gun and ammunition for it. Just go to the gun shop and ask for a 10mm.

    If you are considering using .40S&W ammunition which is rated "+p" by the manufacturer, at the very least do yourself a favor and call the company to find out if they are (a) mislabeling their product for marketing purposes, (b) mislabeling their product because they do not know or understand SAAMI terminology, or (c) making out-of-spec ammunition.

    The same is true for .380ACP and 357SIG and 10mm. There is no +p specification, and ammunition which is loaded beyond SAAMI specification is dangerous. Period.

    The 9mm and .45ACP, however, does have an official SAAMI +p rating. Most modern nines and forty-fives are rated for +p ammunition, though most will show accelerated wear if they fire a steady diet of nothing but +p ammunition.

    In 9mm, most people consider only the +p or +p+ loads as viable for personal defense. While I think there are some exceptions (the 147gr Remington Golden Saber, for example), as a general rule I'd rather have the added velocity from a +p or +p+ round. Unlike the .45ACP +p, 9mm +p does not tend to have significantly greater recoil.

    A +p load in a .45ACP handgun comes close to matching a full power 10mm in both power and recoil. Remington produces both a normal JHP and a Golden Saber BJHP in 185gr +p moving at 1,140fps, an improvement of about 125fps over the normal pressure loads. The Golden Saber in particular is a good design for the increased velocity. For heavier bullets, ProLoad makes both a 200gr +p and 230gr +p using the Speer Gold Dot at 1,000 and 920fps, respectively.

    http://greent.com/40Page/general/plusp.htm

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overpressure_ammunition

    http://www.handgunsmag.com/2010/09/24/ammunition_demystplusp_0306-7/
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2012
  14. squeak_D

    squeak_D Member

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    Yup.., just south of Erie and Edinboro. I live in West Virginia now, and the rest of my family moved up to Erie.

    Thanks for that very useful info regarding +P ammo.
     
  15. SHOOTER13

    SHOOTER13 RETIRED MODERATOR Lifetime Supporter

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    No problem my friend...glad to help !
     
  16. zekest

    zekest Active Member

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    Wear out parts in a Bersa Thunder 380 ?!
    That might take a lot of rounds over a long period of time, about the time you sell the BT380 for a Bersa laser inturrupter hand held modulator module.
     
  17. jc57

    jc57 Active Member

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    I have had two Bersa Thunder 380s (first was stolen, I replaced it). I've shot maybe 60 rounds of the Buffalo Bore "+P" labeled ammo through the two of them.

    I bought the 95gr JHP and the 100gr flat-nosed hard-cast lead versions. The JHP appears to be using the Speer Gold Dot bullet.

    Both types of ammo fed without problems. The recoil on the BB +P ammo is noticeably stouter than other ammo. I tried a mag with alternating BB +P and Winchester PDX1 to compare it to other SD ammo and you could really tell the difference in felt recoil.

    The ammo uses a low-flash powder and I could see the difference in the low light of the indoor range I was at. The flash was a dull red versus the normal bright white, so that claim is also true.

    I don't own a chronograph but the Buffalo Bore web site posts the muzzle velocity and they are reputed to be quite honest in their posted data.

    All in all, I found it to be some good stout ammo, and the Bersa Thunder 380 fired it without problems. I don't shoot much of it, just enough to verify functioning and occasionally run a full mag through to stay familiar with the recoil.

    I have mine loaded with the 95-gr JHP right now and have been carrying it loaded with Buffalo Bore ever since I range-tested it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2012
  18. SHOOTER13

    SHOOTER13 RETIRED MODERATOR Lifetime Supporter

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    Good to know JC...Thanks !
     
  19. Bear

    Bear Member

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    Guys, these are not +P loads.,, They say they are but they are hot loads only. If you look up the SAMI Specs you will see none listed for 380ACP..
     
  20. jpshaw

    jpshaw Well-Known Member

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    I actually carry the Magtech 88 grain .380 round which is touted as +P and rated at 1080 fps. However, velocity is subject to certain factors that may be different with each gun. Polygonal barrel will usually have very slightly more velocity than normally rifled barrels (of the same length). So this 1080 fiqure comes out to barely 950 coming out of my abbreviated 2.7" P3AT barrel. It's probably called +P because it is closer to SAAMI specs then most rounds are.